More Online Drama than Afternoon Soaps

Moderators: kylervk, Joe, Hank Fist, inx515xhell

Post Reply
User avatar
joseph
Posts: 5024
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:24 pm

walmart food?

Post by joseph » Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:48 pm


User avatar
El Rhino
515 Ambassador
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:12 am
Location: South Side.
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by El Rhino » Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:10 pm

It's definitely a good thing. The more people buying organics, the better, regardless of Wal-Mart's motives. I don't see any problem with making better quality and more environmentally friendly* foods available to the masses.



* sometimes organics come from further away and use more fossil fuels in transport so they're not ALWAYS a better choice environment-wise.
Image

User avatar
Nam
Posts: 2170
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:14 pm
Location: everywhere you want to be
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by Nam » Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:42 pm

but will it still say "made in mexico"?
blah

User avatar
TooManyHumyns
Posts: 2223
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:47 pm

Re: walmart food?

Post by TooManyHumyns » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:42 pm

no, apparently most of their organic goods come from...surprise! china...the problem that would be brought up is this: under all those trade agreements floating around the world, companies set their own standards... china/mexicos 'organic' produce would fall far short from american standards, they dont sell usda certified organic, but they can still call it organic, because according to va-chinas standards it is...supposedly, china still uses certain chemical agent pesitcides and whatnot on their organic food...also, its sooo disgusting polluted with smog over there, i bet that alone would take the organic certification away...whatevs....blahblahblah...im sure you can find all sorts of info on hte web...or on wakeupwalmart.com...

User avatar
TooManyHumyns
Posts: 2223
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:47 pm

Re: walmart food?

Post by TooManyHumyns » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:44 pm

apparently the usda label is on produce now...im sure there is still an arguement and questions about it though...if it is fully legit, i consider it a good thing...i honestly think organic food, and 'green products' should be the norm...and crazy chemical agents in food and goods should cost more...

User avatar
TooManyHumyns
Posts: 2223
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:47 pm

Re: walmart food?

Post by TooManyHumyns » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:46 pm

i consider it a good thing aside from the impact that it will have on local organic farmers in the states...as this is whats wrong with our country economically...we import almost everything, and have almost nothing left to offer the world...whoops.

User avatar
Joey Chaos
Destroy!
Posts: 4369
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:35 pm

Re: walmart food?

Post by Joey Chaos » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:52 pm

Here's a funny quote from wakeupwalmart.com
Wal-Mart Associates don’t earn enough to support a family

* The national median family budget for a family of four (two parents and two children) in 2005 was $39,984, more than twice the average full-time Associate’s annual income of $19,165. [Sylvia A. Allegretto, Basic family budgets: Working families' incomes often fail to meet living expenses around the U.S 2005]

Wal-Mart wages are not designed to support a family
So, if one Wal Mart associates average yearly wage is $19,165 a year, and the family budget for a family of four is $39,984, that'd put them pretty fucking close, unless one of the adults in said family of four didn't work.

If both providers were Wal Mart associates, they would make $38,330. While that's not quite the estimated budget, I'm sure they'd be alright.

Do you guys not read this shit before you post it?


I realize that whomever wrote that on the site proved their point much better by comparing the needed budget to the income of one Wal Mart associate, but c'mon, atleast try and make the shit believable.

User avatar
TooManyHumyns
Posts: 2223
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:47 pm

Re: walmart food?

Post by TooManyHumyns » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:58 pm

i wasnt using 'wake up walmart' as a 'hey, this site really tells it like it is' just as an almost sarcastic reference...as they patrol walmart specifically to try and find everything they do that is unethical...i havent looked at the site since it was 16.

User avatar
El Rhino
515 Ambassador
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:12 am
Location: South Side.
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by El Rhino » Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:14 am

TooManyHumyns wrote:i consider it a good thing aside from the impact that it will have on local organic farmers in the states...

...like exponentially expanding their market to sell their crops.


I couldn't find anything right off the bat on that wake up Wal-Mart site about organics but I do know that for a product to have the USDA certification to be organic, there's some strict criteria the product has to meet - there's no gray area. It's either really organic or it's not.



I understand not liking Wal-Mart and all but I think objections to them getting into the organic business are pretty much rooted in snobbery. While there are certainly good reasons for choosing organics, there's also a bit of status that goes with it. Said status goes out the window when a lower-middle class family that enjoys football, shows on FOX and voting Republican can get access/afford the same shit.
Image

User avatar
maxxwell
Always Touring
Posts: 566
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:36 am
Location: Detroit, MI
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by maxxwell » Wed Apr 07, 2010 3:24 am

Food Inc talks about this. Its pretty neat, people are saying how this guy and organisation are traitors working on getting organic food into walmart.

i think is great, makes it easier and more affordable...and can get these companies better ability and resources to keep going.
iON TOUR MOSSSSSST OF THE TIME - http://www.myspace.com/senderreceiver

ImageImage

User avatar
ilikehorses
Fun\Death Dealer
Posts: 3260
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 2:02 pm
Location: des moines

Re: walmart food?

Post by ilikehorses » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:02 pm

El Rhino wrote: * sometimes organics come from further away and use more fossil fuels in transport so they're not ALWAYS a better choice environment-wise.
that's the only real problem i have with it. that and China's lax organic standards. i know they say they meet USDA's standards, but just from what i've looked into, the Chinese companies are often allowed to monitor their own company / plants. the USDA / US never really check into their production methods or what they are using. so maybe it's organic, maybe it's not.
Even today, I can't see a car run a red light without instantly having an image flash into my head of a man's erect penis, penetrating a watermelon.

UGH I SUCK

@nonymous
Posts: 1932
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 2:05 pm
Location: iowa
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by @nonymous » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:17 pm

couple of good articles on the subject: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/14/opinion/14sun4.html and http://pollan.blogs.nytimes.com/2006/05 ... -bad-news/

older articles, but still relevant.

choice quotes:
But here are the pitfalls. Wal-Mart will now become the 800-pound gorilla among the other, slightly smaller gorillas that have tried repeatedly to weaken the Agriculture Department's definition of what organic means. There is no chance that Wal-Mart will be buying from small, local organic farmers. Instead, its market influence will speed up the rate at which organic farming comes to resemble conventional farming in scale, mechanization, processing and transportation. For many people, this is the very antithesis of what organic should be.
The industrial food chain, whether organic or conventional, inevitably links giant supermarkets to giant farms. But this is not because big farms are any more efficient or productive than small farms — to the contrary. Studies have found that small farms produce more food per unit of land than big farms do). And polycultures are more productive than monocultures. So why don’t such farms predominate? Because big supermarkets prefer to do business with big farms growing lots of the same thing. It is more efficient for Wal-Mart — in the economic, not the biological, sense — to contract with a single huge carrot or chicken grower than with 10 small ones: the “transaction costs” are lower, even if the price and the quality is no different. This is just one of the many ways in which the logic of capitalism and the logic of biology on a farm come into conflict. At least in the short term, the logic of business usually prevails.
Wal-Mart’s big-foot entry into the organic market is bad news for small organic farmers, that seems obvious enough. But it may also spell trouble for the big growers they’ll favor. Wal-Mart has a reputation for driving down prices by squeezing its suppliers, especially after the suppliers have invested in expanding production to feed the Wal-Mart maw. Once you’ve boosted your production to supply Wal-Mart, you’re at the company’s mercy when it decides it no longer wants to give you a price that will cover the cost of production, let alone enable you to make a profit. When that happens, the notion of responsibly priced food will be sacrificed to the need to survive, and the pressure to cut corners will become irresistible.
Last edited by @nonymous on Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H. L. Mencken

@nonymous
Posts: 1932
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 2:05 pm
Location: iowa
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by @nonymous » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:18 pm

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats" - H. L. Mencken

User avatar
El Rhino
515 Ambassador
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:12 am
Location: South Side.
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by El Rhino » Thu Apr 08, 2010 4:41 pm

@nonymous wrote: There is no chance that Wal-Mart will be buying from small, local organic farmers. Instead, its market influence will speed up the rate at which organic farming comes to resemble conventional farming in scale, mechanization, processing and transportation. For many people, this is the very antithesis of what organic should be.
[/quote]


So potentially making the organic industry more efficient is a bad thing? Hmmm.




Also, Eddie, does it actually say anywhere that Wal-Mart's organics come from China? I don't think I've ever been anywhere and saw a "product of China" stamp on produce, let alone anything organic. I wouldn't trust anything from China as by all accounts, it's a filthy and disgusting country.
Image

User avatar
Nam
Posts: 2170
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:14 pm
Location: everywhere you want to be
Contact:

Re: walmart food?

Post by Nam » Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:23 pm

i cant imagine shipping produce from china would be cost effective or benificial nomatter how anti america walmart is
blah

User avatar
Shane
Posts: 725
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:34 pm
Location: Iowa City

Re: walmart food?

Post by Shane » Thu Apr 08, 2010 6:24 pm

When a huge amount of it is shipped a long distance, it is cheaper than shipping several smaller amounts a shorter distance.
Joey Chaos wrote:Shane's gonna find out the hard way.

Post Reply